my comment is about sinceon september 11, our treasure has been spent on wars and other things.nd this process to access and how we are going to do with theselk people and how it directly influences how we can import and export our products. with when you talk to t the public today about how she we should bg dealing with this.>> guest: we >> host: okay, that question impo ford "that used to be us."thin e >> guest: that is a very important question. ire think one of the things weyg have to look to do in the future yearsspend too many many basically investing in the muslim world with guns. war. by supporting one dictator or another in the cold war the toit cocoa really empower them with schools, books, and

teachers instead to really deliver to them what they want, the tools to succeed in the 21st century. we talked about that a little. we really believe this is really got to be a new model how we relate to that part of the world. > host: tom, with the protests going on, the anti-american protests, could you put that in context of the larger picture? you've been covering the area for a long time. >> guest: two things. one, it's a competition in the world between the far right and the far, far right. the far, far right want to really march on and embarrass the regular fundamentalist muslims, and main street muslimsic like the breerhood, see who outbids the other to be a better servant of mohammed or

that cementment is coming out. we saw remarkable events in libya yesterday with mainstream moderate libyan democrat took on the bad guys themselves. that's a great thing, a wonderful sign, and a hopeful sign for the future. >> host: michael, anything to add to that viewer in atlanta? >> guest: yes. we both believe that it is important for the united states to play an expansive role, important for america and people of other countries, and that costs money, and it's going to be difficult to find the money with whars coming. the wars we fought in the last decade in afghanistan and iraq, they were expensive, controversial, probably always be controversial, but we ought to recognize as well that the biggest obligations we have, the greatest pressure on taxpayers and on our fiscal policy comes not from those wars or policies

people disagree about, but the policies we all believe in, programs everybody wants, namely social security and especially medicare, and unless and until we find ways to reform those programs to make them more affordable, we're going to continue to have trouble, both abroad and at home. >> host: and the last call for our two guests comes from bill in california. first of all, bill, where in california are you, and then go ahead and ask your question. >> caller: marina del ray. >> host: thank you. >> caller: okay. i never hear discussed what, to me, is clearly and obviously the real problem in the country. i like to paraphrase james' old saying in the election of 1992, it's the economy, stupid. it's the culture stupid. the culture of america is changing for the worse, and we see it in our terrible, competitiveness ratings, you know, with the foreign countries

in math, science, ect. it's not hard to make chose changes. politically, it will be very difficult, but it's really quite cheap, and nobody ever talks about the kinds of things we have to do, and it's not putting more money into education, ect.; it's getting the kids to want to learn. if they want to learn, we could spend half of what we spend and we'll get better students. >> host: bill, thank you very muchtar. >> guest: anybody who is concerned about american values and american culture should read "that used to be us" because there's an extensive discussion of both, and we do feel it over the last 20 years, some of the core values have eroded. in particular, there's now a greater emphasis on the short term than there used to be, and not as much emphasis as we need on the long term. there's no doubt that culture and values are important. it's part of the story. it is not the whole of the

story, but we do deal with those -- with that issue in "that used to be us, and although changing culture and reenforcing values is difficult, we believe it can be done. >> host: tom? >> guest: there's a chapter in the book called devaluation, about the shift in the country from sustainable values, values that sustain relationships, companies, markets, to situational values, do whatever the situation allows. we see too much of the latter. we need to get back to the former. >> host: who was the audience in mind when you wrote "that used to be us"? >> guest: concerned american citizens and everybody who is not an american who cares about, is worried about, and counts on the united states. that really does include the whole world. >> guest: we like to say the book is what the election should be about if we had a real election. >> host: "that used to be us" is out in paperback, national best seller, tom freeppedman and

michael joined us here at [applause] >> hello, everyone. hi, nick. i can't believe when i'm standing backstage listening to ms. karros do those things about me, i want you to know -- by the

way, it was in january by the way. because you know why? i thought i had figured out a way to make teaching pay. [laughter] tv job, right? be a teacher in the tv job. this is unbelievable that left in january another surreal teacher. but when listening to ms. carroll said those nice things to me, the greatest compliment at the end of the year was i gone through this journey with her and i'm reading your staff. she said -- she asked me what i consider coming back? i thought that was the greatest compliment, you know? but i said, ms. carol at my age, i'm not sure what to care this much about anything.

[laughter] well, just 90 thank you all for being here. i appreciate you coming. and another thing, this is weird. you know, writing this book and been out on this tour, a lot of teachers coming up to me. and by the way, most of them say, i accept your apology. [laughter] february go, people are going, i accept. but i realize -- and i did do a year. i stayed a year. it's no small feat for those of you. i know there's a lot of teachers here, but it's 181 days that i was counting. the funniest thing about being a teacher is nowadays are bad. her member would snow days are good? you lose your momentum. they come back like they haven't been there. it's the weirdest thing. anyway, i digress.

what i want to say as i as i did do the sometimes people go wow, a whole year. but when you see the need and the commitment of other people, the commitment of some of the teachers that have been there. one of the things that is really, you know, sad, but has to have been as many of the baby boomer teachers are now retiring. a lot of times that was sort of the back bone of the school in a lot of cases. i think lynn and in some of the teachers that were there when i was there would've been a a very different experience. there's a guy in the school, chuck carr, head of the math department at the beginning of every skeptical -- very skeptical about me. she said i'm sitting in my room, this guy walks and. he says are you here to act the

teacher, mr. deanza or be the teacher, mr. danza? >> i got here. but at the end of the year we were walking down the hall and he was coming back. he had put in his papers to retire and then decided not to retire. and i asked him why he was not coming back and he said well, maybe this year i'll get it right. so 37 years, holy mackerel. so sometimes they do feel a little pretentious that i should be the one talking about this. it is quite a journey. it really was. by the way, great to be back in philly, can't wait to get my cheesesteak. clawback by the way, ms. carroll is a good principle. you know how important it is to advocate principle. i just want to say, ms. carol.

so i guess what i should do is tell you how this will start. so i was closing in on 60, okay? is over the speed limit. i was closing in on 60 and i'd just gotten fired. i do show in new york. i was here -- thank you. thanks, mom. and i was heartbroken. i really was. i was thinking, maybe i should think about something else. i started thinking and 68, which they do the rest of my life? i went to school to be a teacher and then my life went on. when i had my first pro fight and my mother spent all that money sending me to college to be a teacher. she said are you out of your mind? and then i told her i was going to be a cab driver.

she said are you crazy? and then i got taxi and she changed her mind. [laughter] so i was feeling down a little sired for myself. i love the job in new york, but i have this thing about teaching. it's been in my mind a long time. anybody who watches who's the boss knows that tony -- [cheers and applause] thank you very matched. it's so cool to have that. [laughter] but anybody who knows most tony became a teacher. that was no accident. so it's been something that was on my mind. and like most americans i think we're worried about the education -- education in america. i mean, every president as long as i can remember has been the education president. every time he's going to be the guy. so i wanted to fulfill that

thing. i had another thing, you know, arthur miller said the best thing you can hope for is issuing up with the right broker a. and so, i have this regret, what is my great regrets is that i was not the best student. you know, i didn't really understand that the teacher was trying real hard and that was his life for her life's work. and i was one of those guys i try to charm my way through and then do as little as possible and get by. if i spend as much time studying i did it tonight and it would've been all right. so i have every grade and i think it is one of the things that we have to deal with now if we are going to ever fix education, is that the kids have to understand this is an important moment in our lives.

it's not like it was when i was a kid that she could fool around. i got lucky. in those days you could get an assembly line jobs or construction job and have a middle-class life because the country would give you that. but that is not the way it is anymore. in the book -- this is really -- let me cut to the chase and forget about how i got here. this is really what i think is important. i don't think until he commenced the kids if we want more for them than they want for themselves. [applause] and it's almost like you need a national campaign of some kind akin to the way we change the attitude of the country about smoking or about drunk driving. much in that way we have to convince the kids, you know, here's my psa. i gave one detention -- it's in

the book. and the kids wanted me to get the detention. so the good kids want to see the bad kids get punished because otherwise they can't figure it out. slide a couple of girls say to me, mr. danza, and you've got to grow some balls. [laughter] but you know as a teacher and i'm sure you are aware of this, you don't want to come down because if you do you might lose them even worse. so trying to find that sweet spot. but anyway, the day came finally, second semester. her name is charmaine and she was a great kid and she was a great student at times. other times she was just a maniac. so she comes in late. she comes then and disrupts the class. that was there. i pulled the trigger. i said that's a pink slip. she'd give it to me and i'd give it to her back. another said in a cell at the

pink slip in senate down. now sit in a cell at the pink slip in senate down. i didn't know when i gave the detention i had to be there. [laughter] don't they just go to some detention place? anyway, she meets at 7:15 in the morning and we talked. and i was constantly trying to beat the same. i wanted them to not -- to learn from my mistake. you don't have to do this. you can be a good student and have fun. it's not mutually exclusive. you don't have to be one or the other. so i had a big sign, i made the kids make it up with the sinai. take part in your own education, just trying to drill this in because this is what i was missed name. so i say to charmaine, a

fisherman, how long do you think of the in-school? she goes forever. [laughter] i said no you're not. here's your life. this much is school. i said you don't want to be over here looking back saying i wish i would've done better. and what happens here will affect the rest of your life. you've got to understand that. and i don't know in this culture, you know, we have this crazy culture that sends messages to the kids every day that and the radical to education, to undermine education. i mean come you tell kids, good behavior and hard work will pay off. they watched "jersey shore" and say mr. danza, you're wrong. and here's the problem. i was talking to this very wealthy woman, old money. and she went to work on "jersey shore."

i don't know why she picked on me. italian -- i don't know. anyway, she says i hate the people on that show. i've got no love lost for the people on the show. don't get me wrong. but if i was 22 and he said go to the beach, act out and will pay you. so i said to her, i've got no love lost for this case, but how do you feel about those whose that you were with last night, they should dinner with last night that are making billions off putting that on air and making billions of dollars off of their? one of my friends, the guy from viacom made $84 million last year. ms. carroll has to pay 2.5 million out of her school and this guy made 84 million on the backs of mob waves. [applause]

and believe me, i know there's bad teachers. these factors. but i saw more discourage teachers. i saw -- i really did. in the statistics bear it out. 30% after three years, almost 50% after five years. this is just as they take as they have to get out of there. that's my solution. i don't know how you implemented. how about the message? the messages you send the kids. looks great, everything else, but schools, you know how the vote. and this is really important. and then they go to the mall and see with that looks like. i said now, this is important. and that's the thing.

these messages are constantly going to the kids. also in the southern message and that is what teachers do everyday and when i tried to do. i don't know considering the environment we live in, i'm not sure how you go about doing that. for me, this was a journey of once the cameras lapped it was really funny. i thought i was going to lose my authority. i was afraid that i would lose my authority once i didn't have the cameras. but once they were gone, so liberating. and second semester by the way is much better than first semester. everybody is just much more comfortable they are. the first time i was there, i was writing some teacher jokes, like for instance, you use those graphic organizers to some of the words come as some of terms,

collaborative teaching, modeling and then somebody told me i needed a venn diagram. i heard that, i made a doctor's appointment. [laughter] the second part of this journey was really writing the book. it was almost part of teaching. i read a quote book with my son. this is the closest i came. i like to call it a memoir cook book because my son was born when i was 19, so you get to him that uncle sinan engram parents and he and i book and the stories about the uncles and aunts. i said that's it right there. it's very nice. it's called don't fill up an anti-pasta. but we wrote this book and connected stories to the recipes.

but this is like writing a book. and not only back, but it's sort of the same responsibility. here's another thing we don't talk about about teachers and say you have a job to do, but it also has this tremendous -- the weight of the future of the children. i mean come the msm that day and they don't get that day that. it's in the 10th grade they were going to get. that is why it was so nic. for people who saw the show, i did a lot of crying. at first i was crying because i was scared. i thought i bit off more than i can chew and i can't do this. but then i started crying because either that broke my heart were they made my heart soar. it was either one or the other. they do that to you. but i thought okay, i wanted to write the book to tell the story of the rest of it and also to talk about what i saw and spam issues. it's not a book that preachers,

but it listens to people in the book and i kept very good records and the journal. issa video, my lesson plans. so i'm pretty close to what really happened and we discussed a lot of the issues in the book. a lot has changed, though since i was here in two years. i was the commencement speaker that was so cool. but she is, call the philadelphia schools are dealing with budget cuts. i know she mentioned a fundraiser he did. she did a teacher verse student talent show, which was great. the reason that it worked was because they have laid off one of the school nurses because of budget cuts. don't get me wrong, it's bad enough they're laying off the gym teacher, the art teacher in the shop teacher, but the school

nurse? and so, i don't mean to make lists of the other, but we went on television locally and did a little promotion and he was very different from when i was hearing the promotion. we went out on tv he did this and we had a good crowd. but this time i mentioned the school nurse amanda was over lake two dozen people came out. it was crazy, unbelievable. so you're dealing with this kind of change here. i mean, it was hard enough then. i can't imagine taking more out of the budget. i'm a union guy. [cheers and applause] my father was a garbage man for the city and i've been on the screen actors guild for 35 years myself. i just don't think the benevolence of companies.

i think we have to be together. and i'm also a big supporter of public education and that it is a leavening -- you know, at levels the field. we all do together. instead of us be more and more chopped up, you know, there's a think 40 schools in up to 64 privatize. don't get me wrong. i want every kid to have a good teacher, being a great school and i want them to want to learn. but the way this looks to me -- i'm just calling it as i see it. it looks like a forerunner of a two-tier system, where you are going to have one group and were you'll have the kids at the motivated parents and motivated students in one school and you'll have the poorest and lately asked motivated kids -- by the way, another thing you

have to tell the kids. and i'm sorry -- that's one of my problems. i talk too much and i have add. for one of the things you have to tell the kid is in spite of what our formidable and legitimate options on trent obstacles, no matter what they are, whether it's poverty, violence, no home, no parents, bad teacher, that school. you still have to make this piece of your life work because otherwise in 20 years they won't say you know what, he had a bad teacher. that doesn't work that way. that's what we've got to try to make them understand. that is what is in the book a little bit. [applause] i'll just wrap this up. i feel the hook, ms. carol.

[laughter] anyway, i just want to thank you so much. by the way, i wrote 90,000 words, just so you get an idea. i decided i wanted to write this book was painful. it really was. i found a book about writing called first he fixed the refrigerator. [laughter] you will do anything rather than sit down. i'll fix the refrigerator. but anyway, i wrote 90,000 words. some of my friends say he wrote a book lights come on, give me a break. so i want to be honest, i did have somehow. i handed in my manuscript. i was so proud. it was an amazing feeling to push the send button. in a high started doing it? i was getting so distracted i would go to sleep at 7:00 and wake up at two in the morning and read until 6:00 and then go

to the gym, work out a mac can go my god, what is that? but i wrote 90,000 words, handed in my manuscript and they said was that to get you an editor. and it got me this wonderful woman who really helped me and somehow she found 75,000 predicted words do matter and that's how i got the book. anyway, i know we're going to spend some time together. thank you so much. i really hope you enjoy it. listen, i really mean it. i do apologize to every teacher i've ever had. [cheers and applause] >> said the way we had originally set this up as we had passed out no cars. tony wanted to do this more

impromptu. so keep it alive. but she'll have to say tonight, otherwise i'm not going to hear it. so if you raise your hand, we look at micu. we only have 20 minutes. >> because he's in the book. [laughter] >> hi, how are you, kid? yes, sir. >> i asked the kids and the reaction -- [inaudible] do you have the decency to send me a card and thank me. >> he was great in the talent show, trust me. >> i sang --

[inaudible] [applause] >> please raise your hand, man. >> yeah, you said that she cried a lot, from sadness -- [inaudible] >> there were so many. they were really so many because there were times when they just -- they were other times immediately after where they turn it around and say you just did this to me. but i had a poetry contest. i wanted the kids to learn a poem. i said you know, i've got a couple of teachers. they brought them up and showed the kids, had to be tan lines. we had to be able to google it.

we had some biography, figurative language, but we had to memorize and perform in front of the class. i got a bunch of teachers and we've got numbers and made it like a big thing, but here's a big advantage of being a rich teacher is that i could go buy prizes. so first prize was a flip can. remember the first prize was a flip can and $10. second prize was $8. so you now, i give them time to learn a poem. i said i can learn a poem in one night. they picked the palm and i've learned that 32 lines in one night. if you can keep your head up without losing --

[inaudible] said anyway, first commencement speaker there i did the whole poem. i'm telling you people were like this guy is crazy. but anyway, it was one particular girl in the class who was another -- she was a challenge, a real challenge. beautiful, but a challenge. and an enigma because this is the thing about it. you got this class and they all have lives and all this stuff is going on in there. you know, that this other thing i've been doing. people say was the hardest thing about being a teacher? they say let's start with hundred 50 students. it sounds almost okay. if you see teenagers, diego i get that. last night but anyway, she was a challenge. i would stay out of her way. so she sat in the back and she sat next to this guy.

but i was walking and it was like the end of the cluster maggots in 20 minutes to memorize poems in it have this contest and i was walking around, sort of looking up a poem might be. i look over her shoulder and her poem without a deadbeat father, and absent further. and it crystallized what this kid -- who knows what he is going through. and i have daughters, you know, so i go out cio. and from behind i heard, you crying? [laughter] i said no, i'm not crying. [laughter] and then another kid, this great kid said you're a crybaby, mr. danza.

as i turned on him. i said, i am not crying. this is why we read poetry. to steal, to get in touch with the way we feel. i wanted to be touched, that's why we read poetry. so now the contest comes and she gets a no we are really into it. she gets a manual to hold the poster board for her and she stars. and i can't remember the words, but she gets about two or three lines in and she stopped. and you know, it's like you think they forgot. and all of a sudden she just dissolves into tears. she started sobbing. she runs out into the hallway. bound by the way, this girl has beat up everyone in the classroom and now she's crying. so i thought okay, i'll be right

back. and by the way, a teacher can never have too many tissues. i go into the hallway and she's out there -- she's like this, don't choose the? this is what we read poetry for coming to get in touch from our feeling. and this is wonderful you have a poem that touches you. do you want to go back and died? she said i've got to get gangster. i said okay, i don't care how you do it. just let's go do it. so we go inside -- we go inside and she starts again. takes two, and i do the whole thing. ladies and gentlemen, direct from the sands hotel, i do that thing, and she starts again and starts crying again. she did this thing that was so heartbreaking. she opened her arms, looked up the sky and said why can't i say this palm?

[laughter] she runs out into the hallway again. so this anon two or three times, but we finally got her through the palm. every once in a while i get an e-mail from her and she still knows that poem. [applause] >> lady in blue on our left. >> i wrote it down so i wouldn't forget. i am a new teacher -- [inaudible] i've never been so stressed out and so unhappy in my own private time. i love the classroom, but i cry every weekend and i don't have a life. >> and imagine if you get married. >> i don't think that's going to happen. >> what you do then? >> i think i may be one of those

people that has to walk away and that's really upsetting. but i recognize -- >> here's the thing. i don't mean to catch you off. i got a high who had a letter from a teacher. he said he used to think he was the only one who cried. he said every day, i sit at my desk and i sob. and i don't know -- you've got to read a book i think because i think the only thing i can tell you is that you are not alone. you are really not alone. it is a battle. [applause] the hope is -- i mean, the hope is that it gets better. i don't know how it's going to get better. and then the other hope, and here's the one thing i can give

you this also in the book. i'll redo the whole book here, but anyway, there is a teacher there named lynn dixon. she was at northeast over 30 years, just incredible. anything you need from a classroom, from magic pencils to a biking helmet, she's got it. but on the way out, at the end people were so nice to me at the peace. they got to the point where i had to get away. so i just felt like i didn't do that much. you know what i mean? as i was walking out, i had to make a train. she handed me a box. it's another one of mistakes and things. so i got on the train and then i took it out and it was a little

plaque with a scroll, with a brass squirrel on it. and it tells a story of a big storm that boils the ocean and washes a thousand starfish onto the beach. the clouds break, the sun comes down. a guy comes walking along and sees other starfish. he starts picking them up one by one, throwing them in the water. another guy comes along and says there's so many agronomic in a much of a difference. i picked up another one and said it's the difference to that one. so i mean, that's really the only thing you looking for is to try and make that difference. [applause] and i want you to know, i am not sure i got any of them in the water, but maybe a little closer. i wish i could tell you more. i really do. i want to give you a raise right

now. [applause] >> a fellow with his hand up against the wall. we will start with this gentleman right here on our right. >> why philadelphia and why northeast high school? >> welcome to philadelphia because they let me. at northeast high school because they let me. actually i didn't have as little choice in philadelphia. he was the champion of the project and that's how i got here, but he actually offered three schools. the third one essential, for nasa. that's the one. and northeast. and northeast to me was the most comprehensive. you know, it's a big school, everything from magnet schools to special ed. it's just an incredible -- i

mean it, it's an organism. it's amazing. and so i just felt that that was a more representative snapshot of what evidence thinking about. >> very much like you, i got into this 15 years ago among other things in the world. and the reason was because i was tired of blaming teachers. but let me step in their shoes and see the job they have to do. i agree with you and i like your show and i like your book just as well. my question is really more, i am wondering if you've experienced this, i've experienced this, do you think a lot of people elect to make these decisions about our educational system, administrators, politicians and the like, if they were required to go out and actually do something in the letter.

[applause] a lot of them say that they used to be teachers. but you know, i'm always going, okay. >> up to you something. it's so bad. you know how bad it is. i talked to a guy the other day, some place, one of the shows. boy, try doing that show. [laughter] thank you very much. but this guy says to me, my wife's a teacher for 15 years. i said i hope she likes the book. he says you know, it's a tough job. they say yeah, come on, she just took 10 weeks off. that is the husband of the teacher. it has been at the teacher. imagine if you don't know her. now but, you're right.

it's as simple as that. and by the way, how i got talked into the reality show -- i want you to know something, i had no use for reality, no time for that baloney. and my argument was the reason it wouldn't work is because it's cross purposes. the tv show's purpose is the kids. you know, they can't go together and that was a problem. but they convinced me that we could do it. and to some degree we did. but the thought was that maybe it was actually inside of the high school come inside the teacher shoes and maybe would get that kind of an experience to people, that it would have a wider impact. of course it only lasted six weeks. >> okay, we've got time for one more. >> we've got you, sir.

you're coming. >> what is your next project, tony? >> next project, i am in the really early stages, but am working on a new sitcom for abc. [applause] i want to -- i'm of a certain age now. i want to do a show at the golden girls, the guys. [laughter] i want to discuss that kind of stuff. and a dear friend of mine passed away, her name is elaine howes and peered she ran this restaurant with this waterhole in new york and it's gone now. if you ask for the all over the place, but anyway, i was thinking about maybe opening a website or lands because i wanted to be near my house, my apartment. so it would be like the wayside,

one word, though. the lands west side. but then they'll sue me, i'll get some publicity, and be unopposed and that i'll rename it tony's and i'll have a hit. [applause] did you get this gentleman right there, yeah. yes, sir. >> have you ever motivated the unmotivated or defy a student? >> i just -- the only tool you have is persistence. the only tool you have -- and the other tool, you think there's anyone other tool. it's your enthusiasm and excitement for the task they teach you. but i'm excited about it, you know, they're excited about it. the other thing i tried to do because of how i felt about my own experience was i try to connect everything to their

lives. so if i'm teaching julius caesar and i'm telling them that they should understand this life is so important, when they go find anthony, he says in the affairs of men there is a tie on the fortune, omitted the rest of his life. he said i understand that. but i think it's just persistence. i do particularly challenging kid in the book. i changed his name. he graduated, by the way. but i just wouldn't give up on in. i mean it. and there's even a scene where i go visit him in jail. not really jail, but you know. so again, it goes back to the young lady's question. how do you do it? is a calling.

and then here's the beauty, so since ms. carroll is here it's got to tell you this story and then i'll finish. select attitude through the book got a chance to take the kids to new york city. so we got in a bus and were having this trip. so all of a sudden it was not of a new york city paper were going to see west side story and go to friend's restaurant, pat's, 56 and eight, were frank's a notch to hang out. i'm going to take the case of this fancy italian restaurant and then by side story. and so people started coming in now, they want to be chaperones. [laughter] so of course, okay, by the time -- it figures three students to one teacher. but anyway, i got a message that

ms. carroll wanted to come on the trip. the principal wanted to come on the trip. select from that india. they say you know, who's going that was fun, a that i want you to know, ms. carroll wants to go will so she's to teach you well called making the that that ms. carroll is a

but me explain something to you. she's going. we can handle at one write her going to new york and i will have a friend of the principal's office. what do you think? it took a while, but they sort, to answer your -- this goes months later -- by the way, but months later i'm i'm sitting there, grading papers. all of a sudden a kid told my

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this reimagining of other people's ids. >> live down on the mall and we

are joined by susan tejada, who is the author of this book, in search of sacco and vanzetti.whd ms. tejada, what happened? delivering cash boxes of payroll to a shoe factory went out of nowhere to gunmen appeared, shot them dead, grabbed the boxes, threw them into an approaching getaway car and left guns blazing. that crime several weeks later resulted in the arrest of sacco and vanzetti. >> with a guilty? >> this is an unsolved mystery that cannot be proven.

however, i laid out the evidence and i think it's impossible that vanzetti was guilty and nearly impossible but sacco was guilty. i also present new evidence that implies based on evidence the circumstantial evidence that is very persuasive, but one of the murdered victims that had been coerced into helping plan the crimes and then double cross by his conspirators. >> did this become a national trial or was it pretty localized in the boston area? >> for most of that time it was a local massachusetts case. towards the end, the protests were around the world really every continent except for antarctic of people were organized and protesting. they had come to believe that the men were innocent and the judge had been grossly prejudice

>> why are we talked about sacco and vanzetti in school? >> you know, that's the question. you would think after all these years that would have subsided. it actually was one of the first courtroom dramas that justifiably could be called the trial of the century, and it became a worldwide notorious worldwide in part because the first defense attorney was politicized so word got out. then as the appeals to kurt chaim going through the process, the judicial process, the prejudicial remarks of the judge became notorious in a few months

before the execution, frankfurter who at that time was a harvard law school professor published a scathing attack on the constitution's tactics and on the judge's behavior, and his analysis is very influential in getting the world out. >> who were sacco and vanzetti? >> they were all italian immigrants. they were ordinary guys come he was a skilled worker in a factory, and vanzetti had an odd job after immigrating to the united states and he had started working as a fish vendor. they were ordinary immigrants, but in the united states, they became radicalized of the

anarchist leader who advocated violence. but it was ordinary, and i think the fact that they were just too ordinary guys caught in a nightmare that it's part of the reason we are still talking about this today. we think they are there for the grace of god. >> finally, susan tejada come something about your book was april 15th, 1920 you put it in context. it was also the opening day of the boston red sox baseball season, first year without babe ruth. why do you do that, why you put it in the larger context? >> i really hoped to bring their readers and to the story to make it seem real so that the readers

might feel they are in the courtroom, they are in the prison and in the death chamber. it's important to make history come alive. >> susan tejada this is your first book right? >> first adult book. >> you've written children's books? what is the name of one? >> i've written children's nonfiction books about geography and geology. >> susan tejada is the former editor-in-chief of national geographic world magazine coming in here is her book, in search of s s s s s s s s s s s s s s s >> here's a look at some books being published this week:

>> up next on booktv, "after words" waste host karlyn bowman. this week, richard miniter and his latest book. the reporter argues that president obama has been indecisive and conflicted throughout much of his presidency and many of his victories can be credited to someone else. this is about an